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BRACKET 2 - DISCUSSION
http://best-mix.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=201
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Author:  Xythar [ Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

By the way Umineko was not a very good file IMO

edit: before you call me out for just being a DDR player/stepper who doesn't "get" ITG style, I've written a number of well regarded ITG style charts (incidentally so has jammitch!, the person who reviewed your chart) and your file is just sloppy and amateur.

For starters, you have a ridiculous amount of freeze arrow abuse. You have a ton of freezes that are too short to even count as freezes (since you can just tap them and get an OK), you have freezes where you've coded the end of the freeze so late that the following arrow graphically overlaps it even on 4x, and you just have a whole lot of freezes everywhere that have no point at all to them. If you think you need a freeze every time there's a sustained note in the music then think again, we're not playing o2jam here.

Your step placement is passable but boring (not that I should probably be talking there >_>), some of the rhythms are a bit questionable (random cyan arrow out of nowhere early on), a lot of the jumps are pretty pointless, and your song cut was terrible (goes on for too long then just randomly fades out). Also your song choice was pretty lousy in terms of steppability, I like the song but it's not DDR/ITG material.

So yeah, bad file even by ITG standards and if your buddies at r21 disagree then that speaks more of their standards / bad taste than it does of the quality of your file. But seeing as how I have yet to see anyone there who isn't an idiot, I don't really expect them to know what makes a good file either. Anyone can just put down steps in sequence that don't double-step, I wrote a program to do it once. That alone doesn't make your file good.

There's always one every competition, huh.

Author:  irxevan [ Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

jammitch! plays ITG and is a very good player.

I made a post over at r21freak explaining why they're dumb. Hopefully they'll get it. If not, c'est la vie.

Author:  BLueSS [ Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

Xythar wrote:
But seeing as how I have yet to see anyone there who isn't an idiot, I don't really expect them to know what makes a good file either.

Well, Dark Luke is a prominent chart maker over there, and he hasn't been an idiot here at all. So almost everyone there. :)

Author:  irxevan [ Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

These guys believe that every set of notes that doesn't follow a specific pattern in the song (the busiest or most prominent one) is bad. They have a different standard for charts that didn't exist until keyboard and ITG charts became popular. These charts are not about emulating a dance feel, they are about playing IIDX with your feet.

We are a different community with different (and in my opinion, better) standards. We like our charts to have a certain aesthetic appeal (that isn't just in the graphics, but in the patterns themselves) and flavor. We like them to have a gimmick. We like them to have a good difficulty progression. We want our charts to feel like they could have come out of DDR Extreme. That's the idea. Because we enjoy that more. There isn't anything wrong with that.

These guys are dicks, plain and simple. I made a post over there that hopefully will set them straight. If it doesn't, I will try to be civil for a while longer. As many of you know that can be difficult for me when dealing with people with sub-90 IQs! I have no patience for this.

Author:  Xythar [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 12:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

Don't bother. The people in that topic are morons and arguing with them in their own forum is 100% pointless.

Man, I wish I knew what it was about music games that brought out all the sociopaths.

Author:  Oni-91 [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 1:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

irxevan wrote:
I made a post over at r21freak explaining why they're dumb. Hopefully they'll get it. If not, c'est la vie.
Didn't you do this back with DDRMAX3, when every single one one them in the thread overlooked the first three letters of the name, saying phrases like "horrible 7 footer trend"?

Author:  orangelove [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 2:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

BLueSS wrote:
NIQ9 wrote:
I posted the video on r21freak, yes with less than pure intentions, but I didn't expect anyone to leave comments like THAT.

That's crap; you were encouraging people to make fun of him, his girlfriend, and the video.

I believe this to be a gross misrepresentation. He stated that there were valid points in the review, but that he was dismayed by the lack of substance and detail in the criticisms levied against his entry. The only inflammatory statement in the initial topic post was "silly noobs" (plus some ironically insubstantial criticism of another song in the video). At worst, NIQ is guilty of getting butthurt about a negative review and posting about it in the spam forum* without thinking. He made no incitement whatever to post mean comments about the reviewer, or his presumed girlfriend who is not referenced at all in the topic post.

*an important footnote to contextualize the comments made in the offending thread:
Quote:
Disclaimer (Description of the Junkyard)

Here will be kept the lowest of the low.

Any spam (this includes shameless advertisements, pointless thread creation, etc...), posts that violate policy, flame wars that get out of hand, and just about anything else not desirable on the main board will be moved here.

Content herein is not moderated (well, not moderated in a good way anyway - be prepared to potentially have your posts edited/deleted on the whims of mods who have power here), so with that as a disclaimer, please do not cite posts here in complaints or concerns taken up with moderators or administration.

Author:  BLueSS [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 2:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

The thread was made to mock jammitch's reviewing and his video.

You are right in that he didn't actively encourage others to make fun of it/nor him and his fiancee (so in my first reaction to the incident, I did over-respond to that point and I admit it and can say sorry for that), but he also didn't help later in the thread.

such as
NIQ9 wrote:
ahahahaha

the video is private now

what a dick

While this was after the blow-up with comments on youtube, the attitude to me, seemed to be "eh, let them rip into jammitch since he didn't like my file."

Do I know with what intent NIQ9 posted the thread? Not entirely; I can only assume and make guesses. Hence why I made that first post asking him why he did it.

Author:  will-i-am [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 8:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

Quote:
Then why are you complaining? Stop being a pain in the ass.


This post is seriously the only thing that makes any sense in that topic (I only read the first page, then I got annoyed and stopped reading).

NIQ9, if you honestly expected your ITG simfile to get bad reviews in a DDR contest, then why the hell are you asking for some sort of sympathy? You're intentions were obvious. Whether they were good or bad doesn't matter. You just wanted someone to pat you on the back while completely ignoring your sub-par file and call out jammitch! and his fiance for disagreeing with your use of "32nds notes OH NOES". The title of the topic itself explains how you felt while posting it.

Don't even give out shit about how you didn't expect any comments like that. You said you wanted to see how the DDR community felt about your file, and how the ITG community felt, yet you posted in the GARBAGE BIN forum where nothing there can be taken seriously. We gave our fair review, and you bash a member of the contest who's played and created many ITG charts before as well as KB files, mind you, with complete hostility. That I just don't get.

Oh yeah, and since when do you have to play dance games on $300 metal pads? Why in the world would Konami sell soft pads if these types of games were only meant to be played on metal pads?

Author:  Super_Ray [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

will-i-am wrote:
Oh yeah, and since when do you have to play dance games on $300 metal pads? Why in the world would Konami sell soft pads if these types of games were only meant to be played on metal pads?

+1
I've enjoyed playing many files from these competitions on a soft pad, even 10 footers. There's ways to mod a soft pad and keep it from moving around a lot and it doesn't cost very much.

Author:  Jezendar [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

I'd just like to say thanks to jammitch for making these videos in the first place. Hearing comments about my file while watching said file in action allows me to instantly visualize what the reviewer is talking about, and thus I had some ideas on how to improve my file even before the review was over. I hope he continues to do this in the future, regardless of the behavior of certain people.

As for the soft pad versus metal pad, I haven't played on a modded soft pad before, so heres my question: Is it possible to play a 13-footer even on a modded soft pad? This might explain their disgust for such an item.

Author:  LK4D4 [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

Super_Ray wrote:
There's ways to mod a soft pad and keep it from moving around a lot and it doesn't cost very much.

... and it comes with a silver lining. (that was a joke)

I'm not getting myself into the rest of the conversation; there's too much for me to say.

Author:  Super_Ray [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

Jezendar wrote:
As for the soft pad versus metal pad, I haven't played on a modded soft pad before, so heres my question: Is it possible to play a 13-footer even on a modded soft pad? This might explain their disgust for such an item.

You can probably play a 13 footer on a modded soft pad, but you probably won't do too well, but it may also depend on how you play and how you mod your soft pad.

Author:  jammitch! [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

Hey guys. After being out of town for three days (helping install the medical software I worked on for three years that will improve patient care and maybe even save lives), waking up at 4 AM today, catching two planes, and getting mildly rear-ended on the way home (everything's fine, not serious enough to report), I get on my computer and find this.

WAY TO GO INTERNET!

At one point I was actually somewhat sympathetic to the complaints. I mean, you could misconstrue the points in the video if you had no idea about the contest, its rules, or anything else, and the comments about the ITG difficulty elements overshadowed anything else because they were fresh on my mind, despite not being the main reason I didn't like this chart. But this is just mean for the sake of being mean. Making fun of my fiancee for playing Standard is absolutely beyond the pale. She's not the one attacking your precious 32nds. Attempting to make fun of her appearance when she's never on camera in the video is even worse. I mean, she plays Standard, she must be fat, right? Never mind that she bikes four miles to work and back every day. And she's breathing like she's actually getting an aerobic workout. Never mind that it's also our fifteenth song of the night, after said biking, and we aren't doing the flat-foot thing, so it exerts a bit more energy than a high-level player often does. (I have small-ish feet; sue me.) She's also *gasp* a nice person, which is a concept apparently lost on some people.

I also retract my attempt to absolve NIQ9 of any responsibility. I was under the impression that he put it somewhere, and then it went to a second site where the flames were coming from. Having read the topic, you're clearly not the worst offender, but you clearly intended to start it, and when I asked you nicely to ask your buddies nicely to tone down the abuse, you basically said "suck it up", and posted it to incite further flames. Nice job. And you have the audacity to call me a dick?

Seriously. If BLue and I can sustain a good working relationship despite our fundamental disagreements on the nature, meaning and purpose of the universe, the least you guys can do is not flip out and name-call over 32nds.

As for my opinion on ITG-style stepfiles, Summer is awesome. I'd never do it on a pad, but it's so much fun on keyboard. Bloodrush isn't too bad either. Or maybe download this and play Grip. It's a 12-footer on expert, and it has 12th notes, so you guys will love it. It's also a 9 on heavy, because heavy should be accessible when there's more than one chart. Single expert only is fine sometimes, but not here.

FWIW, the closest decent arcade machines are an hour from here - ask LK4D4 - so I usually play at home. And I play on Ignitions. They aren't metal, but they also aren't floppy pads. I have a Flux, but no control box. When I was in Cincinnati, I went to an arcade and did Drop Out (FNM) - fast streams, oh no, but they're actually fun - So Deep, and HVAM. I didn't do that great because I'm not used to arcades, but I passed them all. So horrible, right? Because they're not 11s? Maybe if I get back into it I can pass Charlene again (yes, I did it on an Ignition last time); until then I'll have to settle for all the Maxes and My Favourite Game.

To the BM folks, sorry for the drama, inasmuch as it's my fault; it's not what I intended.

For the guys who like them, I'd be glad to do the community pack.

Now that my blood is boiling a bit and I'm awake again, I'm gonna go review some light charts for the people who actually matter. Or maybe not. Screw beginners, right?

Author:  Juub005 [ Sat Aug 15, 2009 9:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: BRACKET 2 - DOWNLOAD & DISCUSSION

And there's the usual drama for a contest. I can't name a simfile contest I've seen or been in that didn't have drama, haha.

I guess I should try to swing this back on topic. China Discotica and Sonic Speed Riders, whose title I can never remember, are in a tie for my favorite, with Astrogation very close behind.

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